Recently, Globalnews.kz published an interview with ex-Emergency Response and Relief Minister and a USSR KGB/Kazakhstan National Security veteran Vladimir Bozhko. In that interview, Mr.Bozhko made a number of dubious statements about Kazakhstan bloggers and journalists, by which those people offered him their Public Relations services in social networks, for money and for services.
Judging by description that the ex-official shared with us, one such Blogger/Journalist was an individual pretty much reminding an ex-CEO of the KTK Television Company, Arman Shurayev.
We decided to talk to Arman Shurayev in person to hear his version of the conflict with the National Security General. And to discuss many other things…
They Are Preventing President Making New Kazakhstan
— Some analytical experts compare the relations between the New and the Old Kazakhstan, as a divorce process between Spouses, who are dividing property and money. What do you think?
— I am in absolute solidarity to that assessment. There is no New Kazakhstan, and never have been. New Kazakhstan is a phrase present in speeches of our President, while no changes have happened in the lives of common people and those who surround myself. I do not see any improvements. Governmental officials infiltrated from Old Kazakhstan to New Kazakhstan. Nothing changed, the same old re-shuffled deck in the office. They are preventing the President making the New Kazakhstan.
— In one of interviews in Mass Media, you said you supported President Tokayev’s fight against oligarchs and expressed confidence that our new President had the full public support. But for that, new administrators and new Parliament are required. How do you evaluate the performance of the present Cabinet of Ministers?
— Certainly, I support Tokayev. The present Cabinet of Ministers is something bestowed upon us by Old Kazakhstan. We knew that Smailov would make the next Premier long before the announcement of the New Kazakhstan concept. Smailov grew up and matured in the Statistics Agency. He is a man who is accustomed to be a commercial artist, who knows how to sell his strokes. Not the type of artist to draw the New Kazakhstan from scratch.
In reality, there are no social lifts anywhere in this country. There is no sphere of human activity in our country that would show the confident movement ahead. Except of Popular Service Centers, we got nothing to boast. That is our only real achievement. Those Centers make us look better, compared to Russia, for example. We are the same old Mordor.
Gay Lobby
— Once you claimed that gay lobby felt themselves rather confident in our country, but you did not report any credentials…You hyping?
— Gay Lobby is everywhere, in all countries of the world, including Russia. Nothing surprises me. Gay Lobbies come into existence, when masses of state governance officials all of a sudden come into possession of millions of dollars. Those people have experienced many sensations, and they want something else. They are a product of the system. Gay Lobby roots out from Old Kazakhstan. As for credentials, I think everybody in this country knows them. For what would I report those names? I am not a Peeping Tom. But, to my mind, any person who ever dealt with Akorda and Government knows them by names.
Fake Or Not?
— Let us discuss your loud statements that triggered public reaction here and abroad. One Mass Medium claim you are trying to play off Kazakhstan against Russia. They claim you resorted to rough fakes, and one such fake was a poster advertising a concert going under the name of “Once Upon A Time in Russia”, which concert was supposed to take place in Almaty. You shared that poster in your Facebook page and you added a slogan to it – “For Russia – Za Rossiyu”. In your post, you wrote that “the concert shall be prevented by all means”. Russian Media expressed opinion that your goal was not to play-off Kazakhstan against Russia, but to weaken the standing of President Tokayev. What would you say to your Russian colleagues?
— I am convinced that a good dozen of European countries voted for cancellation of Schengen visas for Russian citizens, because Russian citizens were collectively responsible for the present war. We see that at present almost 70% of Russian citizens support the war and genocide of Ukrainians.
I am convinced that we will also have to introduce some measures – some limits and restraints, as a minimum. May be we will have to go as far, as to change the visa regime for the citizens of Russia. Russia is a realistic threat and jeopardy to our national security. Look at this -–in the last 5 months, some 300 thousand Russians, may be more, relocated to Kazakhstan.
Considering negative impacts on Russian economy from oil and gas embargos, I shall not be surprised to see 3 million and 300 thousand Russians relocating to Kazakhstan. Out of those Russians, two-thirds, as a minimum, shall be people supporting Putin, as well as statements made by Russian politicians about the necessity to cut-off our northern provinces. They constitute a threat to our future.
— Still, we want to hear your answer to accusations that your end-goal is not to put the two countries against each other, but to weaken Tokayev …
— That is a silly supposition. Some of Tokayev’s statements addressed to Russia are far more robust that mine. As a minimum, President Tokayev performed a non-diplomatic gesture by saying that Kazakhstan would never recognize Luhansk and Donetzk quasi-states. Kazakhstan shall not help Russia in bypassing sanctions. In a soft-spoken way, Tokayev told Russia to move to the same destination, as was indicated in that famous phrase addressed by Ukrainian naval border rangers to that Russian military sea-vessel, after its Commander offered those Ukrainian rangers to holster weapons and surrender. In the light of these facts, myself and Mr. Tokayev are allies.
— if you support Tokayev that much, why did you leave the Public Trust Council? Did you not find ways to work with the new team?
— No, not because of that. To my mind that Council was a temporary organization that was formed as a stage towards election of the new Parliament. But then two-three years passed and we did not even sense the odor of parliamentary elections. No new parties, either…They are not registering new parties. And the Council itself, as an institution, is void.
No Party
— Would you not wish to form your own political party?
— Well, we will see. The thing is that all political reforms that Tokayev mentioned in his March-22 address to the nation were not launched. None of his proposals made its ways to Parliament to become a draft law. You see, how Sanzhar Bokayev and others are struggling.
— But Bokayev is hyping…
— May be, may be not, but that is a different matter. In Russia, for example, some hypothetical 500 individuals get together and express wish to form a party. No governmental body shall be capable of rejecting their registration application. Our country still has that “vintage” provision, by which you need to turn 40 thousand supporters. At present, there is no sense behind forming a new party. That will look like “Don Quixote’s Struggle Against Windmills”. The concept of some political party as a manifestation of the political force has depleted itself. Take a look at Nur-Otan turned Amanat. I do not see that Amanat are capable of influencing the public and the political processes in our country. It is a quasi-formation, an appendix to the system of executive power, that does not decide or resolve anything, not to say that it is not capable of projecting its influence.
Talibs In Their Minds?
— Once you said that there is a Talib seated in the soul of any Kazakh? What did you mean?
— I meant that we should not seek exterior enemies. Our enemies are inside our minds and souls – those are out undecidedness, our sealed lips, our “Tauba and Shukur” (I am doing OK, I do not care). When every Kazakh thinks that his role is inferior and secondary, that he decides nothing, he becomes an enemy of our country.
— We wanted to discuss with you the scandal between yourself and the Muftiyat. You said that all Imams in our country were corruptors and that annual financial turnovers of our Mosques totaled millions of dollars. Where did you get that information from?
— I wrote that post about Muftiyat six years ago, after that radical gunman killed policemen in Almaty. Each and every Imam gets assigned to his post only with endorsement from the bodies of national security. Many mullahs, probably, are agents of the National Security Committee. Their community is some kind of a quasi-religious formation. It is clear, we have Islamic radicalism and separatism. Muftiyat, unfortunately, is not exception. Like any official institution, it is controlled by state. And it has same flaws and diseases, as does our society, including corruption. I still think that Imams are assigned for money.
When I was a KTK CEO, my journalists investigated that matter. Our correspondents in provinces approached local Imams with requests to video-record boxes for cash donations. All Mullahs, except of one, rejected that suggestion. We tried to calculate ourselves, based on sums of donations that Imams report publicly. In the result of that, we calculated some USD 70 million a year. And that sum is lower than what circulates in reality.
Muftiyat is a vertically integrated corruption scheme. My journalists, before doing our own investigation, travelled to Turkiye and visited a random Mosque during Friday Namaz. There, a Turkish Imam openly declared how much donations came in the week before the Namaz. Things there are absolutely transparent. In Turkiye, the first ones to come to help are not Fire Rangers and Relief Operatives, but Imams. They render practical help, provide tents, sleeping bags, food and medicines.
If a person does not have money for a burial procedure, Imams will cover all expenditures and they will help that person to receive a cemetery lot. They practice a totally opposite approach. As for our practices, they are false.
Conflict with a Security General
— Not long ago, we interviewed ex-Emergency Response and Relief Minister Vladimir Bozhko. He communicated to us a description of a person, who reminds you. That person’s relative was sacked from the Emergency Ministry for stealing money from people who reported to him.
— Why did not Bozhko indicate my name, or the name of my relative?
— So, it was you?
— Yes, it was me, alright….You know why I am asking you this question?
— Why?
— Because Bozhko is a liar and a coward. I am brave and open. I protected the lad I know since we were children. He is not my relative. His name is Zhomart Orazalin and you can call him and discuss that situation with him.
Zhomart Orazalin commanded the North Kazakhstan Fire Station for 20 years. His reputation was impeccable, not a single reprimand or negative feedback. Moreover, some six months prior to dismissal, Bozhko with his own hands handed over to him a medal for rescuing people from terrible frost and snow hurricane.
They fired him and accused him of things he did not commit. Only because somebody lobbied by Bozhko wanted to take his post.
My Grandfather and Grandmother were from educated rural middle class, village school teachers. Zhomart’s now deceased parents were administrators. His Father was a School Director for many years in various rural locations in the Northern Kazakhstan. Their family had many children. All of them made careers and became successful without protection and lobbyism.
Zhomart made Fire Station Commander, his brother made Director of a big college, and likewise did the others.
So, I came to Mr. Bozhko and asked him to investigate that situation. At the time of events, I was the KTK CEO and he was the Emergency Response and Relief Minister.
He started repeating all that crap about Zhomart’s being dirty and that his guilt was proven in court.
But the thing is, that Zhomart won all processes in courts! If he was a proven corruptor, would they take him back to the state governance sector? He is currently the Governor of one of the districts in North Kazakhstan. Contrary to Comrade Bozhko, whom I consider a Russian collaborator and a Vatnik (Russian supremacist and pro-imperial activist), I do not hide names.
— Is it true, that after Bozhko’s refusal, you unwound a whole revenge campaign, using informational resources, particularly the KTK Television Channel?
— Let him show us at least one television program insulting his honor and dignity, that was produced during my stay in the office of the KTK CEO.
Poison Pen Letter Against Shurayev
— I quote what Bozhko said – “I had to report his tricks to his supervisors”. They say, you were fired after that report. Is that true?
— No! I can report a funny story, in my turn. After I visited Bozhko’s office, he wrote that Poison Pen Letter. National Security Officers have their own slang-term for such letters – Bogus. In that bogus he mouthed off me, then he put it in an envelope and wrote on it – “Please pay attention”. In practice, it was an anonymous poison pen letter. Afterwards, my supervisor and myself laughed on it. That bogus came a year and a half before my resignation.
— Bozhko insists that you are still after him in social networks for his words about you …
— Not really… You see yourselves all that trash he writes about Kazakhs – we must kneel before our government and thank them for everything. I am not afraid of him. He is afraid of me, that is why he did not indicate my name, likewise the name of that guy, whom he fired illegally. That guy was later re-commissioned in the public service sector. He was justified in court, returned back to the office and only after that he resigned from his post with pride. As for Bozhko, his performance in the office brought his Ministry to disbanding. He manifested himself as a zilch-administrator.
Bloggers Are No Journalists
— Our social network community gave birth to a new term – Abzhanovism (Abzhanov – blogger extorting money for non-publication of disgracing information). Abzhanovists are journalists who publish negative information about someone and then delete it from social networks for money. What are your comments on that?
— I never considered Mahambet Abzhan a journalist. I do not, in general, consider bloggers journalists. Today, I think, journalism, as a profession degraded and lost value a big time. That was the key factor motivating myself to resign. The situation has not changed, unfortunately. Today, Internet is full of Bloggers-for-Hire. That became a profession.